tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post178298491544879201..comments2023-09-05T12:51:25.656-05:00Comments on edittorrent: Counting Your WordsEdittorrenthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14295505709568570553noreply@blogger.comBlogger15125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-43282288189830995462010-02-04T14:20:55.033-06:002010-02-04T14:20:55.033-06:00Harry, I can't say that it's generally fro...Harry, I can't say that it's generally frowned upon, but there are still some who do. Ten years ago, the reverse was probably true -- that most frowned on the computer word count. With the passage of time, we've started to adapt to the new technologies. Always check the guidelines, though. <br /><br />Meg, lol -- I'm far from a math whiz.<br /><br />TheresaEdittorrenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14295505709568570553noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-58688690757262335722010-02-04T12:31:19.618-06:002010-02-04T12:31:19.618-06:00Oh my gosh, thank you. I'll say it again: than...Oh my gosh, thank you. I'll say it again: thank you. This seems like a minor point until you are a writer worried that word count will get you shot down. I've been badgering every writer I know about the answer to this question for weeks. My solution was finally to say: approximately "82,000 words by computer word count" and hope that the appropriate extrapolation into paperback pages could be achieved. Thanks again, for assuring me that publishing industry professional can indeed do math.<br /><br />– MegMeg Kasshttp://www.megkass.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-8208957406912933892010-01-31T20:48:58.526-06:002010-01-31T20:48:58.526-06:00I think a writer's personal style affects word...I think a writer's personal style affects words/page, too. I tend to write a lot of dialogue, and I know that I gernerally average about 200 words/page, rather than 250. I'm not sure it matters for submissions so much, but it's useful for me to know that if I want to write 1000 words a day, I need to get in 5 pages instead of 4.<br /><br />BethanyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-5717464930602486942010-01-31T06:43:05.938-06:002010-01-31T06:43:05.938-06:00So using the Word counter is not an action usually...So using the Word counter is not an action usually frowned upon? I know publishers apply different methods, when it comes to word counting and for some reason I have had a notion that the MS Word count is not how a writer on the submission roll should count the words.Harry Markovhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09140305922494369576noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-76803484793590278662010-01-31T05:15:49.702-06:002010-01-31T05:15:49.702-06:00Perfect timing! Thanks for going into detail to a...Perfect timing! Thanks for going into detail to answer Kiolia's question. <br /><br />I'm sooo close to finishing my MS I can taste it, lol! Each day I check the 250 x wordcount and the computer wordcount. They vary considerably. I must check my formatting. <br /><br />I've not worried too much about word count before as I know to check the guidelines of whomever I query. Of course, when the time comes to query, if the agent has a preferred wordcount method then that could mean the difference of a chapter or two. As I'm going to be around 120K (fantasy), it had begun to niggle at the back of my head. Again, your post puts it all in perspective. Thanks :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-52004819951471490032010-01-30T19:12:10.376-06:002010-01-30T19:12:10.376-06:00The formula assumes standard A-sized (or 8.5x11&qu...The formula assumes standard A-sized (or 8.5x11") paper, with one inch margins, double-spaced lines, courier 12 point or times new roman 14 point. The 250-word formula is reached by assuming you'll get 25 lines of text per page and an average of ten words per line. And yes, sometimes you'll have extra blank lines or lines with only one word, but the estimated length accounts for the white space. <br /><br />In reality, actual word counts are almost always less than 250 words per page. This is why you can sometimes get dramatic differences between actual and estimated word counts. If the difference is more than a few thousand words, make sure you've formatted the manuscript correctly. If you're only getting 20 or 21 lines of text per page, this can make a huge difference.<br /><br />TheresaEdittorrenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14295505709568570553noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-34531751221863181292010-01-30T18:01:45.164-06:002010-01-30T18:01:45.164-06:00That was actually quite interesting! I didn't ...That was actually quite interesting! I didn't expect it to be when I read the title, heh.<br /><br />I'm confused about the page-based word count, though. Doesn't it matter what size page and what font you're using? Does the formula assume you're using 8 1/2" x 11" pages and Courier font? The word processing program I use (Scrivener) doesn't even paginate!Clare K. R. Millerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11841162467916897873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-35253747675020498012010-01-30T17:10:30.580-06:002010-01-30T17:10:30.580-06:00What do you do when one word makes you look shorte...What do you do when one word makes you look shorter than it is? My book rounds out at 80K by the 250 method, but I'm just over 50K with the actual count.Linda Maye Adamshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07203020058437093901noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-3791302537679377772010-01-30T16:22:25.610-06:002010-01-30T16:22:25.610-06:00Funny story on this subject. I had the joy of fal...Funny story on this subject. I had the joy of falling between changes in guidelines with my last submission. When I first sent it, the publisher wanted word count figured by the 250 X Number of Pages to figure out the word count. My book was dead on with their prefered length under that method. About a year later -- while the MS was still sitting in their house -- they changed to the actual computer word count. That new method now put my story on the short side. Almost *too* short. LOL. Go figure, right? <br /><br />In the end it didn't much matter as revisions added a chapter and a half and put me just a wee bit over their desired word count (but still in the ballpark), so it all worked out ok, it was just one of those weird things. But then this submission seems to be all about the "weird things." As I understand it now, computer word count is becoming more than norm. I always check the guidelines though. <br /><br />JTJulie Harringtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02880895598847092028noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-52344884593380285792010-01-30T14:30:49.357-06:002010-01-30T14:30:49.357-06:00The thing about that white space on the manuscript...The thing about that white space on the manuscript page? It doesn't perfectly correlate to the amount of white space on a typeset page. It's a rough indicator, but sometimes even a rough indicator is better than none.<br /><br />TheresaEdittorrenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14295505709568570553noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-41401042944158858392010-01-30T14:20:21.964-06:002010-01-30T14:20:21.964-06:00I round up or down on my queries as well. This be...I round up or down on my queries as well. This became a problem when I entered an amazon.com contest on 01/25. The minimum for YA was 50k, but mine was 50k when I rounded up. I couldn't find anything in the rules saying whether that was okay. But I did find a note that if the manuscript made it to the second round, they'd check word count. I spent quite a while adding to the manuscript, praying I didn't add any typos in the process.Theresa Milsteinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03477761307315565259noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-18775485542136664632010-01-30T13:55:48.118-06:002010-01-30T13:55:48.118-06:00It's been a while and I've forgotten where...It's been a while and I've forgotten where it was (bad Dave!), but on someone's blog I read that the reason for the 250 words per page (which is based on the old manuscript standard of double-spaced 12-point Courier) is because white space in the manuscript will correspond to white space on the printed page so it matters for packaging reasons as Theresa describes, and that the reason for specifying word count rather than page count is for consistency with markets that pay by the word. I don't know how true it is, but it <i>seems</i> logical.<br /><br />I suspect that agents may be a little more conservative about that particular 'mark of the amateur' than editors, since they're less concerned with how to sell the book to thousands or millions of readers and more concerned with selling the book and its author to one of a relatively small number of editors. That's just my suspicion, of course.Dave Shawhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00773380114295267509noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-25222354735226465412010-01-30T13:34:57.522-06:002010-01-30T13:34:57.522-06:00I can't speak for everyone in publishing. All ...I can't speak for everyone in publishing. All I can tell you is my assumption when I see numbers like that in a query letter. It doesn't seem amateurish to me, though there was a time, many years ago, when I would have thought otherwise. Times and technologies have changed.<br /><br />TheresaEdittorrenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14295505709568570553noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-79878881001789214282010-01-30T13:03:11.391-06:002010-01-30T13:03:11.391-06:00I've never understood why publishers used a pa...I've never understood why publishers used a pages x 250 formula. (Okay, well, I understand that actually counting the number of works in a manuscript manually would be worse than writing it, but there are better ways of estimating words per page.) If they want to use that formula, then why not just ask how many pages in the MS?<br /><br />However, I'm a little concerned by the advice to use exact word count. Putting a length of "84,289 words" in a query is regarded by many agents as a mark of the amateur. We're always told to round (84,300 or better still, 84,000).<br /><br />Thoughts?Jordanhttp://jordanmccollum.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6824896765631412903.post-47159340224619355952010-01-30T12:36:44.235-06:002010-01-30T12:36:44.235-06:00Thank you very much for a detailed answer! This h...Thank you very much for a detailed answer! This has been on my mind for a while, as I have a ms with a computer word count of 160k and an approximate word count of 125k. One of these is rather less daunting to pare back!James Prayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12509353283987908424noreply@blogger.com